hammond became the first female coach to win the summer championship in the nba with the spurs. welcome to the "ed show" live from detroit lakes minnesota. let's get to work. >> tonight, the competition heats up. >> i helped lead the effort in the senate against the keystone pipeline. >> as president, would you sign a bill yes or no please in favor of allowing the keystone xl pipeline. >> i want to wait and see what he and secretary kerry decide. if it is undecided when i become president i will answer your question. >> plus fact check. >> during the campaign governor walker promised to create 250,000 wisconsin jobs in his first four year term. >> when the facts come out i think he's going to plunge in the policies. >> and stage fight. >> the most recent five polls

are all going to be crunched together and the top ten gop candidates are going to be chosen to appear on that debate stage. >> a lot of o folks hoping to get into that first fox debate. >> good to have you with us tonight folks. thanks for watching. so this commentary is not about the candidate or candidates. it is about the issues. hillary clinton is now saying elect me president and i'll tell you where i stand on an issue. yet climate change is supposed to be this big thing that is not only confronting the united states but the globe. what it boils down to is that bernie sanders and hillary clinton are running two very different campaigns for what they want to do and that is lead the country. it shows in almost everything they do. remember it is about the issues and the answers, it is not about the candidates. this is not a hillary bashing session. these are facts. on wednesday bernie sanders

volunteers will be hosting 3,000 grass roots gathers in all 50 states across america. supportsers are meeting in home coffee shop union halls in effort to spread the message. so far over 100,000 people plan to attend and the numbers are growing. bernie sanders is out speaking to massive crowds all over the country. and the experts are trying to figure out what is is this? senator sanders is consistently doing interviews on national television. he's talking to the people and answering the questions, anything thrown his way. on the flipside hillary clinton has been holding mostly these smaller meet and greet type events and she says she wants to hear what voters have to say on the issues. she's given a very -- very few policy speech no doubt about it. clinton has given only one national television interview since she's announced her campaign and she's gone so far

as to say she's not running for campaign for the media. and then the money. bernie sanders has raised $15.2 million. hillary clinton has raised 47.5 million dollars. her total fundraising tops 63 million dollars. today we learned one of hillary clinton's super pacs is now sending trackers trackers to monitor bernie sanders and martin o'malley. the organization is correct the record. their trackers have been spotted at a number of campaign events. super pacs are not legally allowed to coordinate with campaigns. and we got to point out that trackers on the campaign trail are nothing new. correct the record released a statement saying we're doing our due diligence and we'd expect others to do the same. sanders and o'malley campaigns have not deployed trackers. this is the first time trackers

have been deployed in the primary it. certainly means these super pacs view sanders as a viable candidate. they won't hear anything out of the ordinary at his campaign events. no doubt. >> what this campaign is about is saying that our great country and our government belong to all of the people and not a handful of billionaires. today we live in a nation which has more income and more wealth inequality than any other major country on earth. that is not acceptable. and together we are going to change that. >> so where are all the negative comments coming from bernie sanders towards hillary clinton? they don't exist. sanders is running a positive campaign. he's never run a negative ad in his life. in his political life he's never

run a negative ad against another candidate. sanders does correctly criticize hillary clinton on issues and point out the differences. he's gone after clinton for not taking a position on the trans pacific partnership. he has criticized hillary clinton on her cozy position with wall street. on the key stone xl pipeline. and earlier today hillary clinton again refused to answer a question on the keystone xl pipeline. >> as president, would you sign a bill yes or no in favor of allowing the keystone xl pipeline. >> well as you know i was the secretary of state who started that process. i was the one who put into place the investigation. i have now passed it off, as obvious because i'm no longer there, to secretary kerry. this is president obama's decision. and i am not going to second

guess him. because i was in a position to set this in motion and i do not think that would be the right thing to do. so i want to wait and see what he and secretary kerry decide. if it's undecided i will answer your question when i become president. >> so if you vote for hillary she'll tell you where she stands on a huge issue when it comes to bringing tar sands to the climate. which is the most toxic oil coming out of the ground on the face of the earth. sanders released a statement saying it is hard for me to understand how one could be concerned about climate change but not vigorously oppose the keystone pipeline. sanders has repeatedly said he's against the pipeline. the difference between these two democratic candidates to me seems to be pretty clear. it is up to the voters to make the choice. it is up to those folks out there in the liberal community

who know the republicans are climate deniers. do a they want to send somebody to white house and support a candidate who isn't quite ready to give an answer on keystone because of process? what? to me that is just unacceptable. hillary clinton is walking into an issue that she doesn't need to walk into. people want direct answers on this issue. this plays right to the trustworthiness of the polls. it also plays right to whether hillary is connecting with the people that she's trying to get to vote for her. she's not connecting with the people. it has nothing to do with whether she was secretary of state. nothing to do with process. you either believe that the tar sands oil is bad, or you think it is not bad. is this a play to wall street? yes it is. is this a play to the big oil companies? yes it is. let's call it what it is. get your cell phones out. i want to know what you think.

tonight's question: do you want to know where hillary clinton stands on the keystone xl pipeline? go to pulse.msnbc.com/ed to cast your vote. we'll bring you the results later on in the show. remember it is about the issues. this is an issue. climate change is supposed to be the issue of our time. keystone xl pipeline. you could say well we can't do it in trucks, can't do it in trains. can't do it in pipelines. do we want to bring tar sands oil that is going to just put money in the koch brothers pockets? is this good policy and she can't give an answer and stands at a i town hall meeting and then well you elect me president and i'll tell you where i stand on something. i have never heard a candidate ever talk like that. that is what makes this campaign so unique.

it is about be absolutes and hillary clinton can't give us an absolute. when all of us out there working on climate change know exactly what the answer is. hillary clinton says she wants to go around the country and listen to what the voters are saying. i'm starting to wonder is she listening to what the people are asking? she has to know this question isn't going to go away. this is the second day in a row. so if she's listening to the people she must be listening to the questions. certainly she has to anticipate. and this is the third different answer she's given i want to point out. the first was she thought keystone was part of a much broader energy package they needed to discuss with canada. that was the first position. the next position was that while she was secretary of state and doesn't want to get involved in the process. and now she's saying well you

elect me president and i'll tell you what my answer is going to be. larry cohen, how can the left embrace answers like this in positions like this? a very direct question. how can those who are concerned about climate change embrace this? >> we can't. these non answer whether it was on fast track, as you said or now on keystone xl pipeline they are unacceptable. and this kind of triangulation. people are fed up. and that is why tomorrow there are 3,000 house visits for bernie sanders. and people are fed up with business as usual. and they want to vote for their believes and values and that is the campaign we're building. >> mike does it matter if the state department started a process -- yob if that's a true or not. they have been talking about keystone i thought for a decade. does it matter what she used to be to as to where she is right now. >> she comments about things she

used to do all the time. the democratic talking heads may not think this is a problem but do you know what they should do? they should go social media. this story blew up on ring of fire. the numbers were starting.let starleting startling. they want an answer. and you do it by being truthful and straightforward. it is not easily done with the long history she has in politics. it is extremely difficult to simply make a convincing brand change as a matter -- in a matter of months. but one way you begin is being direct. being not equivocable. being deliberate about who you are and what you stand for. bernie's message is resonating because we wants to rebuild the middle class and bring jobs back to america and manufacturing back to america and save social

security and medicare from wall street. he's direct. there is nothing equivocable. and if you look at the numbers stz startling that this flaw that hillary's viseadvisors are not helping her with is very much a negative for hillary. >> seems to me if she were to do more national interviews she'd be having to answer this question and being put in an untenable position. is this a wall street play? she knows she's going to get a lot of money out of them and doesn't want to infuriate them and doesn't want to be a target of the big oil companies. can you have it both ways? >> you can't. i think that is the problem. trying to be neutral so you can say to people look i'm going to get elected so i'm not going to take positions on these things. and as we just heard with bernie, we come right out and say this is what we stand for. no to the pipeline. but on the other hand $1

trillion to build infrastructure including all kinds of pipelines across america. but no to the pipeline and no to tar sands. >> here is the interesting thing about hillary's non answer. there are people in congress who are for keystone. it is not like she's going to be going out an on island if she says yes i think we should build it. she would get support from some canadians, she would get support from some canadian elected partial officials. the prime minister. there are some democrats in favor of keystone. so why won't she take a position and say yes or no. >> when you have been running for president since you were 12 it's tough. you have a past history. and her allegiance to wall street, she allegiance there. she can't become a legitimate populous candidate overnight with that kind of history merely saying you are a populous. you have to make a decision now.

it is not one foot in z one foot out. what she doesn't understand is bernie sanders has a lot of time to build this political movement that he's talking about. he says i'm not building -- i'm not just running for president. i'm building a the political movement. she's missing that. the d.c. beltway insiders miss that. if you listen to the talk shows, they miss a that. while bernie is trying to create this change in america, hillary is forced to tie her wagons to the status quo because it is the status quo that put her there. >> the environmental community in this country is going to have to justify why they are supporting hillary clinton if they don't get a straight answer. that is the next chapter of this story. very puzzling. great to have you with us tonight. appreciate your time. remember to answer tonight's question at pulse.msnbc.com/ed. we'll have the results after the break. follow us on facebook and like us on facebook. and watch my feature give me a minute. and you can get my video pod cast at wegoted.com.

the real deal on how many jobs scott walker has actually created in his state is next. and the nfl has upheld tom brady's suspension based on new information. what the patriots quarterback revealed ahead. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ hp instant ink can save you up to 50% on ink delivered to your door, so print all you want and never run out. plans start at $2.99 a month. right now, buy an eligible printer, and get three months of free ink with hp instant ink. available at participating retailers. the most affordable way to print. hp instant ink. leave early go roam sleep in sleep out star gaze dream big wander more care less

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and the numbers are coming in. here is it where we stand tonight. the question, do you want to know where hillary clinton stands on the keystone xl pipeline? 84% yes. 16% say no. keep the voting going throughout the hour on pulse.msnbc.com/ed. it's evil. and ladders. sfx: [screams] they have all those warnings on 'em. might as well say... 'you're gonna die, jeff.' you hired someone to clean the gutters. not just someone. angie's list helped me find a highly rated service provider to do the work at a fair price. ♪ everyone can shop, but members get more with reviews,

live customer support, and better pricing. come see what the new angie's list can do for you. welcome back to the "ed show." thanks for watching tonight. well donald trump hammered scott walkers' jobs record. >> walkers's state wisconsin is a catastrophe from an economic and financial standpoint. i think he's number 36 or 38 overall in terms of the country

for economic growth. and the jobs projection were way, way off. >> trump is right. on last night's show one of our guests said scott walker created 150,000 manufacturing jobs. that of course caught my attention. i didn't know that. the bureau of labor statistics show that wisconsin has created actually 35,000 jobs in manufacturing since walker took office. he didn't come close. our guest is going to correct the record with us tonight respectfully. walker is not the jobs creator he promised to the folks of wisconsin. compare wisconsin to where i'm broadcasting from tonight, minnesota. walker wants to balance wisconsin's budget on the backs of the middle class. minnesota elected governor mark dayton, turn the legislature over to the democrats because he asked and they said the wealthy had to pay their fair share and they did. dayton took the state's $6 billion deficit to a 2 b,

billion dollar budget surface. scott walkers's state budget is $2.2 billion in the hole. now he wants to bring his failing record to washington or maybe the republicans think being 38th is good. i don't know. joining me tonight jenaveve woods. senior contribute we are t the daily signal. also scott paul, president of the alliance for american manufacturing. jenaveve respectfully. i want to give you a chance to restate what you were saying last night. your numbers. clearly there weren't 150 manufacturing jobs created in wisconsin. what was it. >> let me first say this i hope i never have to say it again. ed schultz was right. now i've said it. no i was alluding to the overall job bs number. i was wrong on the manufacturing number. it's much closer to the number you give. but i think the bigger issue

here is scott walker overpromised when he was running for office originally and said i'm going to create $250,000 jobs. how to you create all those jobs? the reality is scott walker -- i should say wisconsin did not suffer as much in the original recession as a lot of other states. they were about 7.3 or 7.4 unemployment where places like michigan were 10.6. ohio was over 9. so they lost about 100,000 jobs. now since scott walker has become governor they have brought back those 100,000 jobs plus another 20 plus some thousand to account for people coming into the job market -- >> jenaveve they are 38th in the country. >> that's because they didn't have as much room to grow. their current unemployment rate is 4.6%. well under the national average.

my point is he overpromised he should have longhand andoked and said how -- >> you are the first conservative i've ever heard say that scott walker overpromised something. >> i think he did. >> okay. fair enough. that is your take on it. and you should also know that i'm correct on a lot of stuff. so but whatever. >> i'm not going to go there, ed. >> scott paul what has walker's policies done to american manufacturing in wisconsin? the manufacturing sector. you work with all these different manufacturing companies and industries. what are the numbers? what is your take on that. >> sure. and while walker's theory is that by undercutting unions and doing deregulation and cutting public spending that the private market in wisconsin was going to flourish and attract a lot of jobs. that hasn't been the case. and it is just not my opinion. as you pointed out wisconsin ranks anywhere from 35th to 38th in private sector job creation

depending on the period of time you are looking at. the coffman foundation ranks wisconsin the worst state in the country for start-ups. wisconsin has had the middle class hollowed out. more than any other state in the country, ed. and you think about the proud tradition of the middle class in wisconsin and how -- how it got built up there. wisconsin also saw a 14% decrease in average household income over that period of time. >> that's big. >> yeah. and so these are -- i mean these are -- and forbes and cnbc who, you know, certainly probably tilt right of center rate wisconsin in the 30s or worse in terms of the business climate. you know you look at mark dayton in minnesota. you pointed this out, ed. you know investing in infrastructure investing in education, raising wages and the minnesota economy, even though states are very similar is simply outperforming wisconsin.

>> what about that jenaveve? >> we'll talk about minnesota. >> let's talk about minnesota. if you want to filibuster jenaveve, go right ahead. >> i'm picking up on his point. minnesota has now a democratic governor. but up until 2010 they had a republican. and i believe the republicans had the state legislature until 2013. so i don't know how many liberal policies you have in play there. >> you have a lot. you have an infrastructure investment raising the minimum wage investing in teachers raising teacher salary cutting classroom size. these are not necessarily republican policies and minnesota is growing. >> we'll see how that plays out over the long-term. but ed you have to look at the longer picture here. >> wait right there. that is a generic statement. we'll see what happens in the long-term. let's go with the facts. we have got two different states here. we have minnesota that said, you know, what, the wealthy has to pay little more. we're going to do something on

infrastructure which scott walker declined over in wisconsin. >> but ed. >> now wait a minute. i'm not down here. there are about 12 different things that have definitely taken place. we've had two philosophical approaches. there was no attack on wage earners in minnesota the way there was in wisconsin. there fsthere nofsthere was no attack on public education. and what we're seeing is side by side two political philosophies working. trying to work in wisconsin and definitely working for the people in minnesota. so what is wrong -- >> ed -- >> the question jenaveve what's wrong with minnesota? >> what's wrong with minnesota. >> i didn't say there was anything wrong with minnesota. what i don't understand is what is wrong with wisconsin. if you have a 4.6 unemployment rate which is basically full employment, how do you say there is this huge job problem in wisconsin? most of the people who want a job actually have one. which isn't true in a lot of other states in the country.

>> so low wage employment is moving the dime forward. low wage employment. because as sot said the household income went down 14%. i think it is a perfect story for the country to pay attention to. because we've got conflicting political philosophies on how to create jobs. one state has done it. another state has not. but i guess scott walker overpromised. >> no -- but i do think he overpromised what he wanted to do and what he needed to do quite frankly when it came to job creation there. but look the people who have lived under thesis policye policies have elected scott walker three times. >> trues are he has. there is no question about that. but that doesn't make him correct, okay on the issues and it doesn't suffice the record that he is unable to achieve. >> the majority of people in wisconsin who vote apparently think he's been correct and they happen to like their economy or i don't think they would keep sending him back to office.

>> i would just say the facts don't lie. and wisconsin is underperforms the rets of thethe rest of the country. >> look at illinois. the left has been running that state for years and i would love to look at their numbers compared to wisconsin or any ore state. >> well we're not. disappointed how filibusterry you got tonight jenaveve. i would have expected more. appreciate your time. up next. the nfl says patriot quarterback tom brady knew about deflategate. and donald trump continues to lead the field despite the controversy. technology empowers us to achieve more. it pushes us to go further.

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evidence from the appeal hearing, goodell concluded that brady was aware of and took steps to support actions of team employees to deflate footballs. goodell alleged brady destroyed his cell phone just before he met with investigators. the nfl said in a statement, smacked him down big time. brady's deliberate destruction of potentially relevant evidence went beyond a mere failure to cooperate in the investigation and supported a finding that he had sought to hide evidence of his own participation in the underlying scheme to alter the footballs. in may the wells report found brady probably knew about footballs being deflated in last season's afc championship game against the colts. or earlier this month nfl players' association sources told a reporter that brady would challenge this ruling in federal court if he lost. for more let me bring in

terrence moore, national sports columnist and great to have you with us. >> thank you. >> this is about the worst thing that could happen to tom brady. to have the nfl come out and deliver smack down statement. this other information would have never got out had he have not challenged it. how do you read this, terrence? >> to put this in perspective in more than two years of watergate watergate, richard nixon never destroyed the tapes. this guy tom brady, the first day he's going to see the nfl cops he destroys his cell phone. it is a wrap right there. totally disgusting what's going on. no question he's going to make the nfl hall of fame. but not only did he destroy that cell phone and that was damning right there. he also damaged his image as poster boy for the nfl forever.

threw his own father under the bus. his own father out there defending him. and the worst of all he's still out there saying he's innocent when everybody knows this guy is lying through his teeth. >> this is an issue of character at the point, isn't it? >> it is. very much so. how can tom brady come out and defend his character after the nfl makes a statement like that? >> well he can't. and, you know, you mention the nfl. and i am very pleasantly surprised that the nfl came down with this ruling. because i was thoroughly convinced that roger goodell was going to play good cop/bad cop. because when the original ruling came down he had one of his lieutenants, troy vincent, come out and make that ruling so it was very convenient for roger goodell to come back now and reduce from four games to say two or three. but what was happening behind the scenes a lot of nfl owners were whispering in his ear telling imnot to back down. because a lot of people are sick

of tom brady and bill belichick and this entire image they have of being goody two shoes in the forefront but behind the scenes being much less than that. >> let's talk legacy. is he going to be remembered as one of the all-time greats or one of the all trooim great cheaters. >> more so the latter. because here is the other thing. we got this going on here. deflategate. you have spygate back there. and the other thing, remember last year the nfl had to change its rule book because of the substitution patterns of brady and belichick. and you also have them spending the decades out there fooling around with the scouting report or injury report. so god knows what else is out there lying in the weeds. put this together and as time goes on people are going to be talking about this as much as what he did on the field and legaciwise that is not a good thing. >> terrence moore with us here tonight. appreciate your time. thanks so much. still to come on the "ed show," why trump is beating every

republican to the polls. stay with us. we're right back. i'm courtney reagan with your cnbc market wrap. stocks trump issing sharply after five days of the declines. dow surgerying 189. s&p 45 and nasdaq 49. twitter also up. reported revenue and earnings that beat estimates. profits from ups came in better than expected sending that stock up 5%. and federal reserve policy makers began a two-day meeting, investors will be looking for clues about the future of rates and the central bank statement tomorrow. [ male announcer ] some come here to build something smarter. ♪ ♪ some come here to build something stronger. others come to build something faster... something safer... something greener. something the whole world can share. people come to boeing to do many different

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welcome back to the "ed show." well, political experts, go figure. donald trump is still leading

the pack of republicans despite being surrounded by controversy. the newest monmouth university poll shows new hampshire voters are giving trump twice the support of bush. the poll was taken in the aftermath about senator mccain's status as the war hero. now trump is facing resurfacing legal allegations. allegations first made in 1993. saying one of trump's ex-wives had described a violent assault during a deposition for their divorce. meanwhile sean hannity asked trump why he thinks why he was doing so well in the polls. >> i guess we engender great love because i have the biggest crowds of anybody and the biggest standing ovations. people agree. i'm not sure they like me. but they certainly like my message. i hope they like me. i think i'm a nice guy. i'm tired after walking all

talk, no action politicians. the only thing way want o is to keep their job. and it resonates with all of these people for trump. >> joining us tonight -- great to have you both with us. professor, you first on this. what is it is that trump is saying that is so appealing at this point? it's got to be beyond "the apprentice" at this point. >> i agree. i think he's appealing to the racial resentment as well as the antiintellectualism. i don't think all republicans like him. i think hi message is really appealing to a select group of republicans and we know from polling data that these tend to be older white men. so i don't actually think the resurfacing of the rape allegations will harm him.

we certainly didn't see the racism racism. we saw his polls increase after he made racist remarks and they didn't shift with the mccain guffaw. although i don't think he can win a general election or even a republican primary. >> bruce, why do you think trump will make the republican party sane again? >> well my hope is that he will in fact get the republican nomination and that he will proceed to lose all 50 states. because i believe that the craziness that he in fact represents that has taken hold of the republican party over the last 10 years since the rise of the tea party is not a winnable -- a winning coalition. and it has to be completely destroyed. salt plowed into the earth. then maybe phoenix-like a new sane pragmatic republican party

can arise that can in fact win the white house. >> so bruce what are these debates going to look like? trump apparently has tapped into a real frustration of career politicians who say one thing, go to washington and do something else and get hooked up in the system and think about themselves instead of the constituents. that is basically where trump is in all of this. how does that sit on the debate stage when he's attacked all of these guys? >> well i think it is important to understand that what is -- the people that are supporting trump are not supporting him because of any positions he holds on any issues. they have an attitude of having a chip on their shoulder that they are being oppressed in some way and he is somehow or other the guy, like in the old network movie, who is just not going to take it anymore. and he has somehow given them voice. and it is the voice of the

know-nothing. people who are angry but can't even tell you what they are angry at. and somehow or other he has given them -- he is their candidate. >> care lienoline nobody saw trump coming. nobody saw bernie sanders coming. is the mainstream media just not have their pulse on where america is and maybe miscalculated an angst or frustration or maybe even anger out there not being portrayed but being brought out by the candidates? what do you make of that. >> perhaps with trump it is more of kind of a train wreck draw. and with bernie sanders it is more his ideology. but i don't think either of them get the nomination or win the general election certainly not. bruce, i wish i were as optimistic i would vote for trump just to make that happen. but his unfavorables are 58% right now. so not only will he not get the

republican nomination he certainly won't win a general election. but if put up against hillary clinton he would lose in all fifty states. >> both of you said this. he wouldn't win state? he wouldn't win alabama? i mean he wouldn't win mississippi? i think there are people in this country that simply will not vote for a democrat and they would be fearful if bernie sanders an admitted socialist and pop listulist would be in there. and when push comes to shove they would say we can't give the democrats the white house again. don't you sew that happening in some way? >> you have to realize that the people who dominate the republican primary, the tea party people the koch operations, they don't care about electability. they care about their principles, their precious principles

principles. but they can't even tell you exactly what they are. and i think that they would rather keep control of the republican party and lose than permit the kind of cleansing that i think is necessary to allow a new generation of leaders that are pragmatic and not just dogmatic ide idea logs. >> i appreciate your time on the "ed show." thanks so much. which of the 16 republican presidential candidates will make it to the fox debate stage next week? that is ahead.

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they aren't happy about it either. >> the day it was announced i was the only candidate that went out there and blasted them. and now more and more people are blasting pundits and others who recognize that this is -- this is a folly. >> we'll talk about who's going to be there and who's getting snubbed. keep it right here. unbelievable! toenail fungus? seriously? smash it with jublia! jublia is a prescription medicine proven to treat toenail fungus. use jublia as instructed by your doctor. look at the footwork! most common side effects include ingrown toenail, application site redness, itching, swelling burning or stinging, blisters, and pain. smash it! make the call and ask your doctor if jublia is right for you. new larger size now available.

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and finally tonight, i guess we're coming down to the wire. republican presidential candidates, it seems like they're scrambling doing

anything they can to jump their poll numbers in the final week. you see, they have one week left before fox news announces who makes the cut for the first republican debate. fox is capping the august 6th debate at ten candidate. the invitation list is based on five unspecified national pols released on august 4th. so it's going to go to the wire. it is a showdown. nbc news crunched the numbers from the last five polls. here's how we think it's going to look. donald trump is at the top. jeb bush is going to end up in second place. scott walker will make the cut. marco rubio is also in. rand paul will be next. ted cruz he's got the next spot followed by mike huckabee ben carson takes the eighth spot the last two spots, well they're pretty tricky. they're really up for grabs. according to the latest numbers chris christie's going to be number nine and rick perry sneaks in at the tenth and final

spot. now, the final lineup could come down to actually decimal points. luckily fox news has set up a presidential forum for everyone who gets shut out of the cleveland debate. the latest numbers show that governor john kasich missing the debate by 0.2 percentage point. he may not even earn a place to debate in his own home state. joining me now bob shrum, professor of politics at usc, democratic strategist. well, once you get the picture there of all the folks who are going to be on stage, what's it look like? how would you rate that as a think tank bob shrum? >> i wouldn't rate it necessarily highly as a thing tank. i have some sympathy and i never thought i would say this for fox news. you take the candidates they'll get about seven minutes apiece

once you have the fill-ins and the questions. you have jeb bush marco rubio, et al deciding whether or not and preparing to try to pull off a bents sen/quayle moment that will take donald trump down. he's very resilient and he'll come right back at them. go ahead ed. >> i just want to remind our listeners, our viewers of that that it was that moment when he said, i knew jack kennedy and you're no jack kennedy. and i remember quayle just looking at him. i don't think donald trump would look -- i think donald trump would fire right back at any one of these guys verbally and might even trip his trigger. interesting you bring that up. >> but they're going to have gamed that out. they're going to look for that moment. one guy who isn't looking for that moment is cruz. because if trump falls off the buckboard of bigotry, cruz wants

to take the reins and ride it all the way to nomination. trum or more likely cruz could be the republican nominee. i agree with you. they'd be likely to carry about 40 states. what's going to happen near the rest of this debate the secondary characters and the jv or junior varsity debate as i call it will take a lesson from trump and say really out ageous things so they can documentate the commentary and so they can get a foothold in this race. we have all seen mike huckabee in the last couple of days compare the iran accord to hitler and the holocaust. there will be plenty to rebuke and at times in this debate what has been called the gop clown car is going to look like the gong show. >> i don't see in a seven-minute total period of time if that's how it breaks down. >> as you say, it could be more than that a minute or so either way. >> right. >> i don't see trump hurting himself. i think he's got the media moxie and he's shifty enough and crafty enough where i just don't think he's going to get pinned

down in that kind of a format. now it's one on one or two or three or four that might be a little bit different. what do you think? >> i think the fact that the speaking time is so limited for each candidate means that while trump can inflict a lot of damage on himself, lord knows he's tried in the last few weeks and he's gone up in the polls. the worse things he says the better he seems to do. i do think that you have people who are smart around bush around rubio, around walker who are saying how do we take this guy on? and by the way, they do have to take him on. because if they don't, they look like they're part of that planet trump, the 30% of the republican party that's so extreme, that so far out of the mainstream that anybody who caters to that as romney was forced to in 2012 won't win the general election. these guys have to face trump and they ought to try and turn it to their advantage. >> bob shrum, you've counseled a

lot connedandidates. what's the hillary clinton advice on keystone? >> to say what she thinks. to come out and take a position. she's being hurt more among some elements of the party and among the general public by the fact that she doesn't appear to be willing to just say what she thinks. and i think she'd be a lot better off just saying what she thinks as a general rule. by the way, trump is an extreme example of that because he says what he thinks and he thinks is wacky. whatever she thinks on keystone is reasonable and defensible and she ought to just say it. >> there are people who certainly supported it. it's about split down the middle. what do you make of her answer about well she was secretary of state as part of the process. does that fly? >> she may believe that and she may feel that having been part of the process she has to wait for it to be completed before she can say anything. but at this point with these questions being raised about whether you can trust her, whether she talks straight, i think she'd just be better off

saying it. look, she's almost certain to be the democratic nominee. and i certainly want her to win that election but i think right now -- and bernie sanders, by the way, is a serious threat to her. i think right now she ought to just say what she thinks. >> bob shrum, thank you very much. that's "the ed show." "politics nation" with the reverend al sharpton starts right now. tonight on "politics nation," mike huckabee taking a page out of the donald trump playbook. guess what? it's working. also president obama drops the mike with a big statement about what would happen if he was able to run again. and officials release new video showing sandra bland alive in jail. trying to debunk a major conspiracy theory. welcome to "politics